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    EugeneEugene shared this idea  ·   ·  Flag idea as inappropriate…  ·  Admin →

    We have read all of the comments on this thread and I’d like to thank you for providing your constructive feedback on this issue. Instead of merely repeating our support and migration guidance that has been laid out on http://msdn.com/vbrun, I’d like to address some of your specific comments here.

    To play back the feedback themes we’re hearing:
    - VB6 is awesome
    - VB6 needs to be brought forward and maintained: in a new release or OSS

    VB6 was and still is without a doubt awesome. VB6 made developers incredibly productive building a breadth of applications and as a result we have a wealth of applications and passionate developers to this day in 2014. One way I see our mission in developer tools is to empower developers to solve problems. This includes both today’s problems AND the problems of tomorrow. VB6, as you all have stated repeatedly in this thread, is an excellent tool for solving the problems of its day. We also stand behind our decision starting in 2002 to meet the current demands of our developers and the industry with .NET. For the scenarios VB6 set out to do, we see VB6 being “complete”. We feel good about VB6 being able to continue maintaining their applications for the past 15 years. Current needs ranging from distributed applications and services, to web applications and services, to devices, to new architectures and languages, required fundamental changes to the whole stack. We looked at how we could accommodate these needs through incremental changes to VB6 while maintaining its essence, and that was not possible.

    To address the modern needs we would need to go far beyond updating the language. We have to remember that VB6 is not just a language. VB6 is a language, a runtime, a platform library, a tool/IDE, and an ecosystem tightly packaged together in a way that made all of them work well together. We’ve worked with many customers on migration from VB6 to .NET and found that while yes, there are language changes, the dominating factor in migration difficulties isn’t the language differences. Even open sourcing the language/runtime wouldn’t solve the fact that VB6 was thought for a different set of problems, and the fact that its strength came from the end-to-end solution provided by all these five pieces working together. Take a change like 64bit, the complete runtime, tools and ecosystem chain would need to be retooled.

    So, moving forward what can we do? Where we have been able to help move forward is in our stance around support and interoperability. The VB6 runtime it is still a component of the Windows operating system and is a component shipped in Windows 8.1. It will be supported at least through 2024. This ensures your apps and components continue to run as you incrementally move forward to .NET. The support policy is here: http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/vstudio/ms788708. There are numerous interop strategies that we developed and evolved to enable incremental migration as you upgrade your skills, described here: http://msdn.com/vbrun.

    In summary, VB6 was awesome. We agree. We don’t expect or demand anyone to throw away their code or rewrite from any of our technologies unless it makes business sense for them to do so. We have to innovate to enable our customers to innovate. It is not a viable option to create a next version of VB6. We stand by our decision to make VB.NET and the .NET Framework. We think they are awesome too. It is not feasible to open source VB6 tools chain and ecosystem. The VB6 runtime was last shipped in Windows 8.1 and will be supported for the lifetime of Windows 8.1. Support and interop are great tools to move forward incrementally.

    I hope you feel we’ve listened to your feedback and that I’ve explained things well enough that you understand our decision.

    Paul Yuknewicz
    Group Program Manager
    Microsoft Visual Studio Cloud Tools

    8026 comments

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      • JonJon commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        @MichaelE

        'Anonymous' is Zagor who was previously banned from this site by Microsoft and over 500 of his posts deleted.

        Zagor has recently used the names Mary, Kerry,Tony Pony, Larry G and Anonymous but has many, many others.

        Zagor claims to program in C#, though he has recently denied this, and now claims to use C++ instead.

        Zagor disappears from this thread for months at a time, presumably when his OCD is in remission, (or maybe just because it is Diwali) but eventually resumes his trolling.

        Zagor claims to be 24 years old.

      • DaniDani commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Gudman commented · October 21, 2017 13:39
        @Zagor alias Anonymous

        Gigim has asked: I AM A VISUAL BASIC 6.0 PROGRAMER, VERY PROUD OF THAT ! SO, PLEASE DESCRIBE THIS CODE, JUST TO SHOW US WHAT A PROGRAMMER YOU ARE:

        cmp byte [buffer+edi], 0x00
        jnz ffs
        add edi, 1
        cmp byte [buffer+edi], 0x08
        jnz ffs

        We all wait !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        VB.NET is a dead language and almost no one is using it. We have to face reality. There are hardly a few hundred people maybe using it actively. On contrary, against all negative comments VB6 is on the rise, especially with new additions and improvements. There are more than 25 million users and high paying jobs all around the globe. This is the truth. Like in nature, everything is born and dies.This is true for VB.NET as well. People should go on with life learning new languages and stop being stubborn on hopeless things like VB.NETand .NET platform.

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Having used both VB6 and NET I can tell you that VB.NET is not suitable for LOB windows applications. I remember having designed complex code in the 90s and early 2000s and it was almost impossible to unit test those complex applications, not to mention the maintainability and expandability aspects. That's the reason why most of the big businesses were happy to remain to VB6 since very early on. It doesn't mean that all software is complex and requires solid principles to separate UI and business model. However for big businesses and their mission critical software this is vital as they want to keep their codebase maintainable and expandable. VB6 is the best choice for windows to do this. Ask any professional software developer and you will see that VB6 is the most popular. It is an almost complete framework with huge user community and VB6 programmers are highly in demand (and very, very well paid). There is no sign that VB6 will go extinct any time soon (supported until 2027). It pleases professional business software developers immensely. Yes there are other software that you can use for mission specific purposes. For instance ADA is a very old language that is widely used in aerospace and aviation due to it's many fail-safe features. Obviously,using VB6 wouldn't be practical in such a case. Similarly, Python is embraced by the scientific community for similar reasons. Currently VB.NET has really no such area, in which it would be the best choice. There are many other modern languages, equally easy to learn and targeting RAD type of environments. That is the reason why Microsoft does not pursue it any longer. Regards

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        We started our company which designs high end software solutions in the beginning of 2000s. In those days .NET was new and all the people were using VB6. We had to make comparisons to choose our platform. We opted for to remain with VB6, as the advantages over .NET ware huge. VB.NET seemed to be a toy compared to VB6 and not to mention VB6 was just a fraction of what is VB6 today (constant community updates). Glad we made the right choice. Today we have no problem with maintaining, advancing and expanding our code and we run a successful business with tens of thousands of clients using our VB6 based solutions.

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Martin Phillips says

        I think you people have to realise that .NET is dead and it's not coming back.
        Microsoft has no reason to bring it back.
        Most of the people who learnt VB. NET are now too old to coding professionally. VB6 has new programmers each day.
        The coding world has moved on with VB6 and Java and those it left behind were left behind because they were not intellectually capable to realize the pardigm.
        I and many others were, however, capable of adapting VB6 to this change. We use VB6 and love it!
        So I'm sorry for you people who are unable to evolve - such is the nature of life. Only the strong survive. You just have to deal with that.
        VB.NET is dead and it's NEVER coming back!

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Why was C# deserted?

        There are many reasons but I would like to present major ones.
        -C# was full of bugs. VB6 has NO bugs.
        -C# could not do multi threading but VB6 can do that. .NET was a very simple platform for not so professional users.
        -C# was easy to hack. VB6 is impossible to hack. Programs written with C# were not safe (buffer overflow problems).
        -C# was not maintainable. It was not Object Oriented, which is a big no in today's modern computing requirement
        etc.etc.etc.

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Robert McHugh commented

        I don't know who "Anonymous" is, but you virtually have no clue what you are talking about. Anyone involved in software development who understand the phases of development starting from the Business specifications, Technical specifications on through to the end maintenance support knows you use the right tool for the right job. To make the claim that no commercial product is written in VB is not only a moronic statement, it means you must know ALL of the products on the market, which you don't. Most of the products I have worked on are comprised of multiple development platforms - using the ones that are most efficient or cost effective for that phase of the project, I.E.: Interfacing to third party database back-end so as not to re-invent the wheel. Many projects start out in one language and are scraped and re-written in another after the proof of concept phase, since it is more cost effective to integrate third party products and usually reduces the development time. As far as garbage code - that's pretty much up to the restrictions and rules implemented by the company for how they want their code written, and as far as MY background - it's 30+ years with roughly 30+ languages including multiple versions of different assembly languages and processors, both in primary use and embedded systems. The number of Operating systems alone in staggering, and most don't exist anymore. You sound like an idiot making absolute comments about these things. You can be the best programmer in the world, and STILL not be a competent Developer, since to be that you must know the areas you are working in at an expert level. So to argue about the "best" language just shows your level of ineptness.

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Windows has many tools by default like Paint or Notepad. What is missing in the tool arsenal is a programming language. Visual Basic 6.0 seems to be extraordinarily well suited since is particularly powerful, fast and with millions of programmers.

        In the community, it was concluded that Microsoft may not have powerful specialists on the programming languages side like they had in the 90's and that would be one of the reasons why they can not make a new Visual Basic 6.X version.

        Another reason in the community gossip would be that they no longer have the source code of the Visual Basic 6.0 programming language probably due to data corruption.

        The list of suspicions is long as Microsoft tried to break the support for VB6 in 2008, but they could not do that because of the masses of programmers who have resisted.

        Another false information would be that VB6 programmers do not want to go to other languages, but as far as I know personally, VB6 programmers know a very wide range of languages, especially C++, Java, PHP and ASM.

        The support for VB6 is now guaranteed by Microsoft until 2027. So it will survive longer than most of the programming packages released right now.

        I think such an idea would be very constructive for Windows 10 and future variants. I wish to ask you what you think of a Visual Basic 6.0 by default on Windows ?

      • Anonymous commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        THE FOLLOWING ARTICLE DESCRIBES EXACTLY WHY VB6 IS ABANDONED.

        We need to understand that VB6 is a very old and inefficient language. It was good in the 90s but cannot be used in today's demanding programming environment. Below we will see why VB6 was abandoned by the industry and programmers in general. Please read carefully.

        "Years ago I read an interesting interview with Bill Storage (remember him?) in Visual Basic Programmers Journal. Last night I found it again at http://classicvb.net/vfred/archives/VBPJ-StorageInterview.pdf.";

      • Anonymous commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Why was VB6 deserted?

        There are many reasons but I would like to present major ones.
        -VB6 was full of bugs. There was huge memory leak problems
        -VB6 could not do multi threading. It was a very simple platform for not so professional users.
        -VB6 was easy to hack. Programs written with it were not safe.
        -VB6 was not maintainable. It was not Object Oriented, which is a big no in today's modern computing requirement
        etc.etc.etc.

        All these problems were corrected by introducing .NET framework.

        Thanks and regards

      • Anonymous commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Martin Phillips says

        I think you people have to realise that VB6 is dead and it's not coming back.
        Microsoft has no reason to bring it back.
        Most of the people who learnt VB6 are now too old to coding professionally.
        The coding world has moved on with VB.NET and those it left behind were left behind because they were not intellectually capable to realize the pardigm.
        I and many others were, however, capable of adapting VB.NET to this change. We use VB.NET and love it!
        So I'm sorry for you people who are unable to evolve - such is the nature of life. Only the strong survive. You just have to deal with that.
        VB6 is dead and it's NEVER coming back!

      • Anonymous commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        We started our company which designs high end software solutions in the beginning of 2000s. In those days .NET was new and many people were using VB6. We had to make comparisons to choose our platform. We opted for .NET, as the advantages over VB6 was huge. VB6 seemed to be a toy compared to VB.NET and not to mention VB.NET was just a fraction of what is VB.NET today. Glad we made the right choice. Today we have no problem with maintaining, advancing and expanding our code and we run a successful business with tens of thousands of clients using our VB.NET based solutions.

      • Anonymous commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Having used both VB6 and NET I can tell you that VB6 is not suitable for LOB windows applications. I remember having designed complex code in the 90s and early 2000s and it was almost impossible to unit test those complex applications, not to mention the maintainability and expandability aspects. That's the reason why most of the big businesses were happy to switch to NET framework very early on. It doesn't mean that all software is complex and requires solid principles to separate UI and business model. However for big businesses and their mission critical software this is vital as they want to keep their codebase maintainable and expandable. NET is the best choice for windows to do this. Ask any professional software developer and you will see that NET framework is quite popular. It is an almost complete framework with huge user community and NET programmers are highly in demand. There is no sign that NET will go extinct any time soon. It pleases professional business software developers immensely. Yes there are other software that you can use for mission specific purposes. For instance ADA is a very old language that is widely used in aerospace and aviation due to it's many fail-safe features. Obviously,using NET wouldn't be practical in such a case. Similarly, Python is embraced by the scientific community for similar reasons. Currently VB6 has really no such area, in which it would be the best choice. There are many other modern languages, equally easy to learn and targeting RAD type of environments. That is the reason why Microsoft does not pursue it any longer. Regards

      • Anonymous commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        VB6 is a dead language and almost no one is using it. We have to face reality. There are hardly a few thousand people maybe using it actively. As we all know the drive to collect 150k of funds failed miserably at Indigogo. Only over 2k has been collected in three months. It is a devastating news for the VB6 enthusiasts. On contrary, against all negative comments NET is on the rise, especially with new additions and improvements. There are more than 6 million users and high paying jobs all around the globe. This is the truth. Like in nature, everything is born and dies.This is true for VB6 as well. People should go on with life learning new languages and stop being stubborn on hopeless things like VB6. Microsoft will never make a free download of VB6 as it is not a ecosystem which is maintained any longer.

      • We want VB6 programmingWe want VB6 programming commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        @Windows 10

        Yes Microsoft ought to include the VB6 programming language and IDE in Windows 10. It installs and runs on Windows 10, it should be included. After all, VBA programming is included in Office.

      • We want VB6 programmingWe want VB6 programming commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        @Anonymous

        >> Is this true? I have never heard of this. Did C# fail so badly it brought down the London Stock Exchange? What a disaster! Does anyone still use the software?

        Yes the .Net based TradElect software failed the London and Jo'burg Stock Exchanges.

        The London Stock Exchange replaced TradElect with the Linux-based system, Millennium Exchange, which had a lower, sub-millisecond latency. The Jo'burg and Oslo Exchanges did the same.

        .Net simply couldn't handle the volume of trade.

      • Windows 10Windows 10 commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Windows has many tools by default like Paint or Notepad. What is missing in the tool arsenal is a programming language. Visual Basic 6.0 seems to be extraordinarily well suited since is particularly powerful, fast and with millions of programmers.

        In the community, it was concluded that Microsoft may not have powerful specialists on the programming languages side like they had in the 90's and that would be one of the reasons why they can not make a new Visual Basic 6.X version.

        Another reason in the community gossip would be that they no longer have the source code of the Visual Basic 6.0 programming language probably due to data corruption.

        The list of suspicions is long as Microsoft tried to break the support for VB6 in 2008, but they could not do that because of the masses of programmers who have resisted.

        Another false information would be that VB6 programmers do not want to go to other languages, but as far as I know personally, VB6 programmers know a very wide range of languages, especially C++, Java, PHP and ASM.

        The support for VB6 is now guaranteed by Microsoft until 2027. So it will survive longer than most of the programming packages released right now.

        I think such an idea would be very constructive for Windows 10 and future variants. I wish to ask you what you think of a Visual Basic 6.0 by default on Windows ?

      • MistressMistress commented  ·   ·  Flag as inappropriate

        Joy Recado commented · October 21, 2017 14:01
        @zagor alias 100 nicknames

        What annoys you is that in VB6 you find everything for free in source code without paying between $ 10 and $ 200$ per app. ;) The most advanced code is free do to Visual Basic 6.0 !

        This message is for the rest of the community as I do not bother to impress you even with a spi|

        1- Regarding VB6 and Tiobe:
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2017/01/tiobe-is-for-sale-pay-tiobe-index-and.html
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2016/04/tiobe-index-without-verticality-or.html
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2016/04/the-pathetic-tiobe-index.html
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2014/05/tiobe-index-for-may-2014-visual-basic.html
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2014/05/tiobe-index-for-may-2014-visual-basic.html

        2- Stackoverflow is full of tro||s that cannot deal with programming! They are people just like you which I can count them on my fingers. Here are the answers:
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2014/01/best-programming-language-in-world-in.html
        https://vb6awards.blogspot.com/2016/02/visual-basic-wins-technical-impact.html
        https://www.codeproject.com/Articles/710181/Visual-Basic-A-giant-more-powerful-than-ever

        3 - I've already told you that Malwarebytes is done in VB6. You do not know how to read ?

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