Marc RousselMarc Roussel

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      under review  ·  324 comments  ·  Visual Studio IDE » .NET  ·  Flag idea as inappropriate…  ·  Admin →
      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      It doesn't support Telerik and many Silverlight projects were using this third party. How can this be converted. Also their migration technique is almost the same as going everything manually which can be done with MVC. Both way of migrating is a pain. Either you create a new CSHTML5 project and add all your files and have to deal with everything that doesn't work with CSHTML5 and there's lot actually or you do everything manually which is to bring all the server code on an MVC project and you work out all your return values as JSon for Ajax call from the client and you have to redo all the UI.
      My opinion is that developers should not worry about anything and just continue working with the same development tool (Silverlight) and at the end a simple button pressed will make your entire project work on the web with whatever they can offer us like WebAssemly or MVC hence conversion wouldn't be necessary. The end result will be a working Silverlight app with Telerik included. But this will never see the light and that's extremely sad !

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      My customer for which I did a huge Silverlight app asked me how much time it would take to convert the project in HTML5. I told him it's a difficult question but I tried to give him an idea based on the fact that I actually work for an employer and I can give him only 1 hour per day, 5 days a week. At full time 35 hours a week I said 7 months but at 1 hour per day it makes 49 months.

      Lots of server side code can be kept using MVC still there's a lot of changes in regards to how the data is returned to the client and then the most difficult part is converting all the C#/XAML code on the client side in JavaScript/HTML

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Yes I agree but you understand that people doesn't have a choice but to use JavaScript as a language for the web it doesn't mean we want to push C sharp language away. The survey just mean JavaScript is being the only language used for client side that's why there is so many people using it. This is the message this thread is trying to explain. I am not scared about this survey I'm just scared about the time it takes to get us C sharp as a language for client side

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      C# is declining LOL

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      This survey doesn't make any sense C# is the one language so many VB 6 programmers switched over since the last years

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      I'm tired

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      @birbilis interesting information you have there. I just hope one thing. I can take the $760 357.32 app I did for a customer and just run it against a new technology and not explaining to my customer I have to rewrite it.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      DRAG & DROP yes a must have but is this possible with MVC today ? Will we see a merge of XAML, C#, MVC or we will just see something with again 15 libraries and 6 syntaxes ?
      I'm on the floor. I want to quit as a developer.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      As I'm doing my 1 year and 11 months in the world of web app development using JS, JQuery, Bootstrap, HTML and CSS to name a few, I remark that developing the UI is taking me 90% of the time for the overhaul application. the Business logic in C# is made at the speed of light. Making a good UI in the other hand is a huge nightmare. There's nothing we SEE to DRAG and DROP and place things and do effects etc. NOTHING !!!! It's a go and GUESS with pseudo code and run the application to see then going back and forth like that is time consuming. I hate developing USER INTERFACE like that. It reminds me of the old LISP development in AutoCAD !!

      Did I tell you how bad the performance is with JS ? I'm so tired of this script it's unbearable

      I want to develop a user interface using some kind of BLEND but when you look at ASP.NET or MVC with visual Studio DESIGN surface is impossible to work with. I'm wondering if I will see a tool like BLEND to develop web application in my programmer life time which by the way is almost at the end.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Can someone at Uservoice filter out these annoying spams like Hartleben Bengston below which we receive by email ?

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      This is what you have to know to make a web application these days

      .NET
      EF
      HTML
      CSS
      JavaScript
      JQuery
      JQuery UI
      Bootstrap
      Razor
      MVC Pattern
      SQL

      What is needed is just this :

      .NET
      EF
      XAML (Great Visual Editor with binding to models)
      SQL

      ;)

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Well, In just a few words regardless of JS, C#, .NET and whatever other things we can think of, we simply want Silverlight back for Cross-Platform, Cross-Browser and Cross-whatever in the future. That's about all.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Yeah however the drop of .NET is less likely considering all server codes are written in that language and not JavaScript. It's impossible to drop .NET entirely. Now JavaScript on the client side is because it's an old technology that people are Hanged on since a long time and is becoming clumsy and fat with lots of problems for developer that embrace beautiful classes, lamba and exception handling the right way.

      So many people going nuts with frameworks of all kind just in hope to be purchased by Microsoft. JavaScript is a very poor language which absolutely need to be replaced gradually with .NET. I just hope MS will be the pioner of such technology

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Pitié, pas un autre framework, je suis pu capable.

      Leaving .NET ? What are you talking about ! JavaScript and all those framework over it which I'm using since 2 years are making my apps FAT and slow. We need .NET ASAP !

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      I just hope we don't have some kind of library needed that resemble C#. We need pure C# both sides client and server. That's all we need and specially a good interface designer.

      That's as simple as that. Nothing more.

      What is interesting is how we, programmers, want to do web application without having all kinds of anonymous objects on client side with no intellisense as it is the case with JavaScript. Developing is so much fun when you have Client-Server understanding each other in the same development environment and same language thus you create your classes on the server side and the client knows about them (PROXY) but please understand that we need to avoid adding a Service Reference and updating it each time when necessary. This was not interesting in Silverlight so to my opinion we need to abstract that work which the futur development environment should do intelligently and silently.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      How long this will stay in UNDER REVIEW state ?

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Can't wait :)

      1) C# Client and server
      2) UI DESIGNER not just mark-up writing.
      3) Superb BINDING system like Silverlight
      4) A conversion tool for existing Silverlight APP is absolutely necessary (if possible)

      We need to do beautiful interface these days and I find it very hard labor to do interface in Razor
      I'm actually redoing a HUGE Silverlight app and it's painful believe me.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      A converter from Silverlight to MVC X is necessary! Whatever the cost because otherwise the cost will go to all those corporations which have lots of Silverlight applications currently running and far too HUGE to convert manually.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      I was wrong about Bridge.NET sorry about that. It's an excellent idea and upon testing it I find it attractive. Should be integrated with MVC

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      All we need is ONE language and the real .NET one please and ONE WEB APP running everywhere. This is what Silverlight was doing so well. We also need something else along that line. We dislike writing HTML by hand for UI thus a need for a great Blend tool to design our interface and having this nice double click action to go right in the C# event code and write the code. I think you see what I mean!

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Bridge ? I just tried this and it's not even close to C# at all. I tried this simple thing and it doesn't even work. I looked at examples and I dislike the syntax not being like C#

      public class App
      {
      [Ready]
      public static void Main()
      {
      Person p = new () { Name = "Joe Blow"};
      }
      }

      public class Person
      {
      public string Name {get; set;}
      public List<string> Compagnies {get; set;}
      }

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Could that be the answer we're looking for ?

      http://cshtml5.com/

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

      Here's my little story.

      I did a lot of SL app for many business and I'm actually the only one capable of converting these apps for them. I'm forced to use HTML 5 and JQuery and a bit of TypeScript and let me tell you that it's not the future I wanted. So sad to see both sides so disconnected. Server side very nice OOP c# code with lamda, linq etc and all the glory that goes with it and then you transfer your object s to the client side to find out that you're playing with strings and some kind of freaky OOP that doesn't have real intellisense at all and I don't want to talk about the UI design in HTML which is totally absent of this world which xaml and Blend was offering so easily.

      So yes we need .NET world of development that targets the web of today. We don't have time to incorporate tons of nuget frameworks to develop a web app. The ideal world for .NET developers are like Silverlight. Nothing less seriously !!!

      You can't imagine the effort I'm putting in converting these apps to HTML 5, CSS, JQuery, Razor, Bootstrap, and more where all I had before was C# + XAML that's all and a very great tool to design UI. All this is lost !!

      From my point of view we don't need to see compilers, transpilers, etc these aren't necessary when developing we just need to see one language, one tool, call it ONEDEV if you whish but yeah that's all we need.

      Well 2 language in fact, HTML 5 and C#. Yes it's ok to loose XAML but at least all the business logic SERVER and CLIENT side should be for instance C# and a GREAT tool to design UI with HTML 5 the way we do with Blend not having to write HTML to see what we want on the UI. That's crazy developing UI with HTML 5 text and run the app so often to see what it looks.

      All this is a huge time consuming thing. What as been said here is what I think so don't take it for granted. I'm just dreaming out loud and expressing what I think about all this.

      Marc RousselMarc Roussel supported this idea  · 
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        started  ·  21 comments  ·  Visual Studio IDE » Debugging and Diagnostics  ·  Flag idea as inappropriate…  ·  Admin →
        Marc RousselMarc Roussel commented  · 

        Why on earth Edge is pushed as the right choice but we aren't able to debug JS from VS ? I'm baffled.

        Marc RousselMarc Roussel supported this idea  · 
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          0 comments  ·  Visual Studio IDE » IDE and Editor  ·  Flag idea as inappropriate…  ·  Admin →
          Marc RousselMarc Roussel shared this idea  · 
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            0 comments  ·  Visual Studio IDE  ·  Flag idea as inappropriate…  ·  Admin →
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